BETTER MAN is based on the true story of the meteoric rise, dramatic fall, and remarkable resurgence of British pop superstar Robbie Williams, one of the greatest entertainers of all time. Under the visionary direction of Michael Gracey (The Greatest Showman), the film is uniquely told from Williams’ perspective, capturing his signature wit and indomitable spirit. It follows Robbie’s (played by Jonno Davies) journey from childhood, to being the youngest member of chart-topping boyband Take That, through to his unparalleled achievements as a record-breaking solo artist – all the while confronting the challenges that stratospheric fame and success can bring.
As Better Man prepares to release in Australian cinemas on Boxing Day, Nick L’Barrow spoke with director Michael Gracey and star Jonno Davies about how they utilised Robbie Williams’ iconic discography to tell his story, filming the incredible ‘Rock DJ’ sequence, and diving into the relationships that meant the most to the rockstar!
Nick: Jonno and Michael, it’s so great to meet you both! How are you today?
Jonno Davies: I’m good, thanks!
Michael Gracey: Doing good, Nick.
Nick: That’s good to hear! And thank you to you both for taking the time to chat. I love this movie. I’ve seen it twice and it’s one of my favourites of the year, so I really appreciate your time. And I’d love to start at the idea that while Better Man explores a fair few relationships in Robbie Williams’ life, the one that resonated the most with me was the relationship with his nan. So, I’m curious to know what the conversations were like for you both with Robbie about that relationship, and what was the importance behind really making in the heart of the film?
Michael Gracey: From really early on, Robbie talked about his nan with just such unconditional love at that point in his life. And when so much on this narrative is about seeking approval and affection from others, having this singular source that is constant, is really grounding and really special.
So, to establish that right off the bat, you know in the second scene of the film, when he comes home and the kids have been making fun of him, and he’s sitting on the couch with his Nan watching TV, there’s just this beautiful bond between the two of them. And the moment things become uncomfortable in that scene, she takes him off and puts him in the bath. I think that’s so relatable to kids and that relationship with a grandparent, because we understand that you just get unconditional love from these truly magnificent beings that are your grandparents.
I think from a relatability point of view, and for a grounded rock in Rob’s life, what makes it narratively strong is that at the point when he’s facing Knebworth, you take away all the things that support him and love him. You take away Nicole, you take away his Nan, you take away his best mate, Nate, and you take away his dad. So, by the time he ends up at Knebworth, he’s literally there without any support. And from there, we watch him spiral again.
Jonno Davies: You know, I think Nan is your hero. I think she’s the person that when you’re watching, you’re thinking this could be the person who breaks through and saves Rob. If there was a world in this movie where someone stripped him of the ‘monkey’, and made him see who he really was, it would be Nan.
So, when she goes, I think you’re mourning, not just her loss, you’re mourning Rob’s loss. It feels like a losing battle as soon as she’s gone. But also, like you said, that figure in everyone’s life that makes you, when you’re watching, want to ring your nan. It makes you look back at your relationship with those loved ones and go, ‘I wish I had done that extra call, or spent two extra minutes with her when she rang me’. I think people feel that in themselves when they watch the movie.
Nick: It’s such a beautiful aspect of the film. I’d love to chat about the songs in the film, and more specifically what the process in choosing songs from such a large catalogue of Robbie’s music was like to help tell his story?
Michael Gracey: Robbie really sort of left us alone to let the narrative drive the song selection. I always say that you sing a song when words no longer suffice. So, you hit an emotional, tent pole moment, and in that moment it was about seeing what lyrics speak to this.
Quite often in films with original songs, like The Greatest Showman, you get to tell the story in a very bespoke way. And when you’re using existing music, a la Moulin Rouge, you’re trying to give existing songs a new context, and that’s a really exciting way to work.
We were very fortunate that when you go through Rob’s catalogue, it is very personal. It’s very autobiographical as to where he is at that moment in his life, you know? So something like ‘Come Undone’, lyrically speaks to a moment where someone is spiralling. I think we were very fortunate in that he does write from a personal place, and we just had access to this vast catalogue of hit songs that we could play with narratively.
Nick: Is there a song for either of you that the context has change retrospectively from when you first heard it, to now after working on a movie about his life, and the understandings of Robbie that come with that?
Jonno Davies: ‘Come Undone’ for me. When that released, I was fairly young and just heard it as a good pop song, right? But as you get older, you actually pay attention to the lyrics, and it’s a such a driving force, a turning point, in our movie. It’s not just my favourite song, but for me, it’s the most hard hitting. It’s his most vulnerable, it’s his most raw. You really see that caged animal in there, battling themselves.
Michael Gracey: Yeah, ‘Come Undone’ has a whole new context now. I think the best songs are the ones where you can’t hear them without thinking back. I’ll never be able to hear ‘She’s The One’ and not think about that narrative on the back. ‘Come Undone’, I’ll always think of that kid driving away in the car, and the emotions he’s fighting with.
And ‘Better Man’. I can’t listen to the lyrics of ‘Better Man’ and not think to that moment on the ice. I think it’s haunting now in a way that is a credit to the original songwriting, to be honest.
Nick: Speaking about how music can affect us, one of the most profound lines in the film, for me, is when Robbie is told, ‘Songs are only valuable is they cost you something’. And I’m curious to know what that line means to you both as artists. Do you have to give something of yourself over to have any form of art mean something?
Jonno Davies: I don’t think it has to. I think that’s putting a boundary on something that’s so objective in terms of what art is for other people. I think, as an actor, my best work is when I have felt like I’ve given… really paid your dues, you know?
There’s something very validating, gratifying, when you finish a day, and you know you have something that would work. That I had to implement myself there in many ways, to get something that’s desirable in terms of our art and our work. I think it’s a sense of achievement.
But the worry with it is that you can overshare with that, right. You can often over give. I think that’s where stuff can get dangerous, where you allow too much of yourself to be exposed. And once it’s out there, it’s hard to bring back. So, there’s definitely a nuanced skill in making sure the right amount is given up, and you still got something to hold on to yourself. Because if it’s all gone, what do you have then as privacy? What do you have then as your own kind of internal being that’s your driving force?
Michael Gracey: Yeah, it’s a good point that it doesn’t have to cost you, but from my experience, everything I’ve ever worked on has come at a huge cost. So, I really relate to that statement. Simon Gleeson wrote that line, and I wish I could take credit for it. It’s a great line. But, definitely in my experience, it does come at a cost.
Nick: I want to shift gears a little bit to discuss what is my favourite scene in the entire film, and that is the ‘Rock DJ’ number. I’d love to know, from a storytelling perspective, what is the process of using a song and large scale musical number to actually advance the narrative like the ‘Rock DJ’ scene does?
Michael Gracey: I think that when you’re doing the songs with the new context, it’s either the lyrics that are driving it forward – because quite often with pop songs, they will have a phrase and just repeat it, that’s the earworm of pop – or you progress the story visually. And so ‘Rock DJ’ is 100% a progression visually.
The boys come out to the street. They’ve just signed their first record deal. Robbie imagines he’s the front man of the band [laughs], and that he is leading them down the street. Just his delusion as to where he sees himself, because obviously Gary is the front man of the band. But they just go from being a bunch of lads just yahooing their way down the street with no one really knowing who they are, to by the end, being the biggest thing in all of Europe.
In the course of just a single number is this great evolution through the early Take That days, and we sort of pinpoint those moments in time through their iconic outfits through time. You’re getting the visual progression in the world, the outfits, and you’re not sure whether the hopes and dreams what Rob hopes his future will be are between imagination and reality.
Nick: Jonno, I want to ask you about a specific element of the character of Robbie that I noticed, and I’m not sure if I’m looking into this too much, but there seemed to be such an emphasis on how Robbie breathes. I’m curious to know how much conscious thought went into the breathing of Robbie.
Jonno Davies: Yeah, that’s really well picked up, man. Myself and Michael had quite a few conversations on breath, and how impactful it can be. Even when it’s not there at all. As soon as someone stops breathing, it’s really jarring and really uncomfortable.
But we also use that as a mechanism between switch between worlds of his imposter syndrome, his fear before performing. That kind of hyperventilation. That switch. It helped with the animalistic side of stuff. We were cautious not to dip too far into the ‘monkey-isms’ that felt like too much of a gimmick.
So, it became about how do we incorporate it with more subtle breath work. It’s one of those brilliant things, similar to going on to your haunches. It’s a human thing, but as soon as you put the monkey on top of it, it really feels like a monkey mannerism. That’s where the magic was in terms of crossover between species, rather than spoon feeding an audience to say, ‘Remember, I’m a monkey!’
Thank you so much to Jonno and Michael for their time, and to Roadshow Films for organising the interview. Better Man is in Australian cinemas on December 26.
